THTC meter - Removal Request

​@monster9 Just an FYI that I removed the feedback section and the link provided from your comment as this wasn’t meant for general consumer feedback. 

Thanks,

I should have thought that consumers in danger of having their supply turned off were those holding the biggest stake in this game. Charities and consumer groups will no doubt wring their hands as usual, but Ofgem would certainly benefit from real-life feedback from those likely to be affected by their proposals.

I responded.
Time has run out.

Emailed this to Ovo on 12 Feb 2025…
Sadly, but predictably, I’ve had no response.
Can anyone here advise when/if these meters are available yet?

Inquiry About 4G Smart Meter Availability

Ovo

I am writing to inquire about the availability of 4G smart meters in my area. I understand that 4G-enabled smart meters are being rolled out to replace older meter types, including RTS meters like mine, and I want to ensure I am prepared before the Radio Teleswitch Service (RTS) is switched off in June 2025.

Could you please let me know when 4G smart meters will be available for installation at my property?

Thank you for your assistance. I look forward to your response.

I'm afraid that your ‘understanding’ is not correct. You appear to be conflating two different things.

Nobody is ‘rolling out’ 4G connections to replace RTS meters in the North of England and Scotland

2G/3G is used for smart metering South of a line roughly through Manchester and that is in the process of being updated to 4G as 3G and then 2G will switch off.

North of Manchester it's a long wave radio signal that is used for smart metering - but a different one than the old RTS used.

RTS meters will stop working the same as they used to when the radio signal that they use stops being transmitted - either when switched off or when the last custom (4-foot tall) radio valve, which is now in use, fails so the RTS signals can no longer be broadcast.

There are no current plans to roll out 4G conected smart meters to Scotland or Northern England (the organisation that runs all smart metering doesn't want to do that) - so do not base your plans on that happening ‘specially’ for you.

It might also be worth mentioning that for questions like this one, you may be able to get a faster answer if you swing by the Forum first as we’re pretty clued up. While we can’t do account specific stuff like “When is X meter type able to be installed at my Y property on Z postcode”, we can give general answers that give you a rough idea. That also frees up OVO’s agents to handle other queries as that email inbox gets absolutely thrashed all the time.

The latest info I have is that OVO has been exploring deploying 4G Comms Hubs on a limited basis for the purposes of testing them out ahead of a wider launch. Couple of Super Important Gotchas though:

• This trial is only available for CSP Central/South aka the Southern Territory (everything north of Manchester is CSP North and doesn’t require this stuff anyway)
• The 4G Comms Hub Trial is NOT being used to install 4G Comms Hubs during RTS → Smart Meter upgrades at this time
• This trial is only being done for customers who already have fully working - and fully communicating - SMETS2 Smart Meters that currently run the 2G/3G Comms Hubs
• This trial is only available to those who are specifically invited by OVO to take part - if you’re with another supplier, please ask them about what their plans are
  • Please don’t switch to OVO purely to get on this trial - I cannot make any promises whatsoever that you’ll be invited
• The OVO Forum doesn’t currently know when 4G Comms Hubs will become widely available as we’ve not had that information come through at this time

If you don’t meet all of the above criteria, you won’t be able to take part right now.

Thanks for the additional detail ​@Blastoise186 

As a Scottish RTS customer who sits outside the SM-WAN (but within the 4G mobile phone network) it crossed my mind that this may be a solution - looks like it won’t be.

I expect I’ll be offered a Smart Meter operating in “Traditional Mode”.

Whether I’ll be offered it in time for the switch-off is anybody’s guess. 😶
Any word on what will happen to customers who don’t get a smart meter in time for the switch-off???

We’re still waiting on that one at the moment. Latest I have is that OVO has asked me to be cautious about how I approach things at the moment so I don’t accidentally throw you off a mountain. Not one of those “you’re in trouble and you’ve gotta change track” things, more just a mutual agreement about the general strategy we’re using here combined with my preference to help manage expectations carefully.

Once we know more, we’ll update the Forum. All I can say is that we can’t promise your RTS setup will continue to work as it does now beyond September 2025.

Thanks ​@Blastoise186 

Do you think it’ll be possible to have a Smart Meter working in Traditional Mode pre-programmed for an EV Charging Tariff?

Holy Moly

Just spoken to Ovo asking for an update, given I live in a no-WAN area.
Apparently, I’ll likely be given a reconditioned clockwork meter configured for E10.

No smart functionality at all.

And here was me thinking this was the 21st Century.

Basically all EV Tariffs (and add-on type stuff like Charge Anytime) across the entire market all require fully communicating Smart Meters, sorry.

After the direct intervention of my MSP, Ovo called me today to arrange a date to install a 4g smart meter in my home in the Highlands.

I’m told they use the o2 network, and were only approved for use in Scotland 4 days ago.

I’ll update on progress next week...

Morning ​@monster9, I hope you had a good weekend.

Thanks for the update - that’s a positive turn of events! Fingers crossed the installation goes smoothly, and they commission the meter so that it’s ‘in comms’ and sends readings to us. You can find more about smart meters on our website here, and I’ll link some helpful Forum topics below that you might like to read through. If you could let us know how the appointment goes we’d appreciate it! 

• Are there any disadvantages to getting a smart meter? F.A.Q.

• Smart Meters and In Home Displays - Topic Hub Tutorial

Cheers!

​@Ben_OVO Less than 24hrs after appointment confirmed - it’s been cancelled.
No explanation as to why.

Well done Ovo!!

​@monster9 I’m sorry to hear that, that’s so frustrating 😤. Please get back in touch with our Support Team when you can, they’ll be able to see what happened, and check when they can get you booked in again.

​@Ben_OVO I did that and have received an email stating that I’ve raised a complaint.

I didn’t ask to raise a complaint.

What I wanted to do was talk to the advisor James who set up the appointment in the first place, given he set up the appointment in response to a direct request from Kate Forbes MSP - on my behalf.

But Hey ho. It appears even the Deputy First Minister of Scotland is treated appallingly by Ovo.

Morning ​@monster9,

To confirm, James is a Complaint Handler, and a complaint would have been raised, even if you didn’t ask for one, because of the shortfall in service. This is correct process - we’d treat this as a complaint and log it this way because of the appointment being booked and then cancelled without you requesting this. The involvement of an MSP would also mean this would have been escalated internally.

I’m sorry to hear about everything that’s happened here, but it being logged as a complaint should mean you’ll have one point of contact, and it should be easier to get resolved than it would be if you were calling into the Support Team and speaking to a different Advisor each time. Keep us updated on your progress, I hope they can sort something for you soon. 🤞

​@monster9 I’d be really interested to hear how you learned this. I can’t find anything about this approval anywhere.

​@Firedog this info was conveyed to me by the Senior Advisor I spoke to.
I’m told that O2 won the competitive tender.

There’s also chat elsewhere about the cellular solution being proposed for Shetland.

I’ve also had a good search and can’t find anything specific about4G communication hubs being ‘approved’ for use in Scotland.

However I found and posted this 2-days ago, and it makes me think that 2-seperate things may be being confused here.
Such confusions are not uncommon - a case of Chineese whispers, in this case with a bit of parliamentary help from  Alasdair Allan MSP to stir up that confusion.

In a nutshell:

Yes, - there is a Scottish Governmant project underway to provide 4G masts in remote areas of Scotland including the Western Isles.
It’s called the Scottish 4G Infill programme (S4GI). 

No, - it is not at this time intended for 4G to be used for smart meter connectivity in Scotland.
Mr Allan’s parliamentery answer only says that  (my emphasis) :

We have delivered 55 mobile masts in rural and island areas, all of which are available on an open access basis and could potentially be used to site smart meter radio infrastructure. 

Note also that that doesn’t say 4G infrastructure but ‘radio infrastructure’.

(It's a typical Parliamentary written answer that at first glance appears to be answering the question asked but is actually saying something different altogether).

IF 4G communication hubs are ever approved for use in the North of England and Scottland then they will be able to connect to those 4G masts.
But I can’t find anything that says such use has already been approved.
IIRC there is some legal reason why only the Arquiva Long Range Radio should be used in the North.

See the link to the Scottish Parliament Q&A’s in this post:

​@Nukecad ​@Firedog 

This FB post backs my statement up…

Update for Shetland consumers.

The whole of Shetland is about to get approval to allow elec suppliers to install smart meters that use the cellular network, approval due end March.

At the OVO public meeting a few weeks ago I had the opportunity to submit some questions to OVO and I've now had responses.

Although an OVO response this should apply to other suppliers, especially the ones who use the same sub contractor as OVO (SMS), from memory, Octopus and maybe UW.

I'm aware that some individual properties in the Arqiva area (N England & Scotland) have had these type of meters installed but there's a lengthy approval process to have them installed.

I'm not aware of any regions in the Arqiva area getting this approval, it's clearly a response to the poor connectivity rate and the sheer number of properties with RTS (reported locally as 5,000).

They're well aware the cellular network is also patchy in areas, this just gives them another option, the ultimate fall back is probably the dumb meter with the configured off peak times. They also have access to cellular booster aerials and hubs to improve the signal in some areas.

This was my question and their response.

Question

Many Shetland OVO customers have reported unsuccessful installs where the smart meters can't connect to the Arqiva signal, in many cases the existing meters have been refitted, and the customers have been advised they'll need to wait for another solution. Has a solution been identified, is it a standalone meter or does it require some other type of comms (3/4G, wifi?) and is there a timetable to commence rollout of the new solution?

Response

We continue to push the Data Communications Company (DCC), who manage the communications infrastructure and are responsible for the signal strength, to improve Wide Area Network coverage nationwide but by the end of March, following approval by DESNZ we will be able to use cellular technology for RTS customers in Shetland. This will increase the coverage we can provide and our engineers will start using them right away. If neither of these solutions work in a customer's homes we have other solutions we would use to remove and replace the RTS meters before the switch off.

I’ll let you know 30-April, when I have an appointment to have a cellular Smart Meter installed in my home.

Good to see some progress on this, even if it is only for Shetland.

Large amounts of the rest of Scotland have no Arquiva WAN coverage either so hopefully a similar approach can be used there so that we can all benefit from the advantages that a working smart meter brings. 

​@Retroanaconda 

It's not only Shetland. I'm Loch Ness way.

I may be the first test in mainland Scotland tho.