Can I connect a CAD to my smart meters if OVO open the Home Area Network (HAN)?

Dead easy - cheers!

Waiting on the change to propagate to the meter (24 hrs) then will see if we can get the Energyhive CAD to play ball. 🙂

Indeed. When actual device arrived and it came to pair up the smart team refused to comply.

I've just been on the phone for the best part of an hour.

The true situation is more complex.

Legally (and technically) your first answer was actually correct.

However the smart team are currently refusing to play ball and are lying in order to justify their position.

The smart team refused to have an adult conversation about this and are punting the customer care team out to take all the punches. (unsporting)

Customer care are going to have words with them this evening and provide an answer by morning. If the smart team wish to lie again in writing I'll be taking this up with the Ombudsman. (the failure to comply and the lie)

Just because Ovo haven't been able to connect to the HAN and pull back the 1-minute interval data that the smart meters provide yet doesn't mean that they should prevent the consumer from connecting a consumer access device to the home area network to do this themselves. (as BEIS intended)

We'll see what the morning brings. Having waited this long for the meters to be installed in the first place it would be frustrating to have to switch supplier and have them switched again just to access the data.

Unfortunately it looks like Ovo have dug their heels in on this one.


Their last response on 22/12/17:

"Good afternoon Mr Cosic,

Following on from our conversation yesterday I have tried to call this afternoon but unfortunately I was not able to get through. [no record of any missed call - MC]

I am currently in discussion with our Smart team and as previously advised it is not our policy to pair unknown CAD devices with our Smart meters as we do not know the impact of the device or the security of the data. The Smart team have however advised that they are liaising directly with Secure to get further clarification and as soon as I have had a response from them I will be in touch.

My apologies that I have not been able to provide a more solid resolution today."


i.e. Ovo have pushed the reason for the delay onto Secure.


My response:


"Hi,


Thank you for the update. I'm sorry to hear that the smart team continue to make your life difficult by continuing to lie to you.

My (non defamatory) accusation - that Ovo are LYING about this CAD not having been tested with the SECURE meter and posing a potential security risk even though it is not a PPMID - stands.


You have until 31/12/2017 to:

1) Open up the HAN and connect this CAD using the details provided
2) Apologise for making statements and accusations that you did not in fact know to be true without the appropriate caveats
3) Apologise for dismissive and combative manner in which you have handled my simple request

Should you fail to do so I shall:

1) Make this a formal complaint. (start the clock ticking)
2) Ask the Ombudsman to review Ovo's potential failure comply with the terms of their supply licence. (this is a separate matter from a consumer complaint)
3) Ask the Competition and Markets Authority to review what I consider to be Ovo's anti-competitive behaviour in seeking to restrict access to the HAN to only the CADs that suit their commercial interests. (escalate to your in house counsel please)


This isn't how this process should work. Here's how is should work: (pp3, courtesy of 'redwood' on the Ovo forum)

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/591322/09022017_-_Smart_Meters__Data__Growth_DR_-_updated.pdf

Please get on with your job.


Thanks,"


I'm not impressed.


Should Ovo modify or otherwise suppress this posting I'll add this action to the file for the Ombudsman and the CMA.

Has Ovo's Smart team finished choosing which hoops we need to go through to make this happen Lucy?

You have been given:
- The exact make/model of CAD (the Hildebrand unit in the link in my initial post)
- The EUI and the Install Code required to pair the exact unit (via email)

Ovo are now saying that the device *needs* to be given permission (whitelisted) in order to connect.

- That's what I'm asking you to do. Go ahead please.

Ovo are *also* saying that the CAD type and firmware version *need* to be tested for stability on their system. That's not true in the strict sense. *Ovo* choose to require this but it is not needed in order to open the HAN and pair the device.

I'll play your game though. Here are the details that you need:

- Hildebrand model CAD (per link above)
- EUI and Install Code (per email)
- Firmware version 0.8.6

Ovo's last position appears to be "Ovo states that this has never been tested"

Or is Ovo back-tracking on their original written statement; stalling on asking Secure meters the question and hoping that I will be satisfied with making a complaint in the same way that Ovo was hoping that waiving the exit fees would encourage me to leave before the contracted end date and you'd get away without having to give an answer or answer to the Ombudsman or the CMA?

Whitelisting means taking the EUI / Install Code for the CAD that the consumer has given you and applying them to the meter - as you do with your own IHDs.


Testing? The excuse for saying "no" wheeled out by a man in the smart team by the name of Ken; who made the mistake of *refusing* to whitelist this CAD when given all the details needed (account number, name and security details, exact CAD make/model/firmware details, and the EUI / Install Code for the CAD) 8 days ago and used a lack of testing as his sole justification.


Ovo aren't allowed to do this (to my eye it's against the conditions of their supply licence and it's anti competitive behaviour) but I'll play the game because if that sole justification for saying no were to evaporate it's going to be difficult to say no twice.


Saying yes is hard because:

- It'll be a complete pain in the backside if hundreds or thousands of enthusiasts start asking you to pair their own devices with the smart meters. (wohoo - another department and set of processes...)
- You're working on your own version of what I'm asking for (collecting 'live' data from the meter using a CAD and the internet instead of 'batch' data the GPRS unit in the meter) that will be much easier for you to administer and means that you control a consumer's access to their own data

Understandable. But the smart metering game has rules.


I'm too impatient to wait for Ovo to built their thing to suit themselves. That particular CAD comes with an API that let's me get on with it now:
https://www.energyhive.com/content/about/develop

Also the whole point of the architecture that DECC / BEIS created is to avoid the vendor lock-in (supplier lock-in) that will happens if the only way to access your meter data is via one particular energy supplier.

That's less of a concern for the R&D project I have in mind than missing *all* of this winter's data due to delays installing the meter and delays pairing the CAD with it. (though imagine many others would object to their APIs and smart devices not working if they switch supplier)

We've had three emails that weren't helpful followed by three calls of > 30 minutes each where we started to get somewhere.

I'm keeping the thread up to date so that others don't have to ask the same questions or go through the same arguments again. 🙂

Sorry you've not had a response yet @markocosic. I'd encourage you to keep contacting the team via email if this is how you'd prefer to communicate with us. As we don't have any of your details on here, we're unable to chase this up via the Forum. If you change your mind and would like us too, just pop one of us a PM with your details so we can help.

As for the license agreement you've stated, the most relevant section indicates that the licensee must take all reasonable steps. As far as I understand the situation, OVO are looking into white listing your CAD as requested, so I wouldn't say OVO are in breach of their electricity supply licence at present.

Either way I really hope this gets sorted and we can get things back on track!

Lucy

Not wishing to muddy the water!

But in this thread https://forum.ovoenergy.com/smart-meters-smart-products-33/when-is-the-new-chameleon-in-home-display-ihd-being-made-available-558 OVO state they are trialling the Chameleon IHD.

Chameleon also make a CAD so could this provide a route to achieving the desired goal. Both Secure and Chameleon are involved in the preparation of this paper http://www.beama.org.uk/asset/EBA9BBB9-756E-48A0-B6C38EBFBC3EEEAB/ (download) so one would hope for a degree of compatibility.

I don't have any faith in an (Open and not crippled by rate limits) Ovo API via Chameleon IHD appearing before winter is over.

(this was suggested this as a solution before being offered the bung go switch supplier and become somebody else's problem)


Would Ovo refuse the use of 3rd party gas meters in place of their supplied meters?

Something like a Diehl Aerius is available with non-proprietary, non vendor-locked, European standard protocols that facilitate remote reads:

http://www.diehl.com/pl/diehl-metering/produkty-i-rozwiazania/pdb-details.html?tx_diehlproducts_pi1%5Bproduct%5D=69794451566&tx_diehlproducts_pi1%5BbackPid%5D=522&tx_diehlproducts_pi1%5Baction%5D=show&tx_diehlproducts_pi1%5Bcontroller%5D=MeteringProduct

It would have to *replace* the utility meter rather than sit downstream due to pressure drop limitations though.

Update:

The Consumer Access Device has now been paired. (EnergyHive firmware version 0.8.6 with the Secure Meters smart meters)

This was indeed easy: all Ovo need is the exact make/model of CAD, the EUI, and the Install Code, and the CAD to be powered up and in range of the smart meter.

That exact make/model/firmware version of CAD had indeed been tested with the Secure Meters smart meter too.

The smart meter team at Ovo, once you're permitted to speak with them, know how to do this.


A formal complaint was raised, and it was requested that Ovo acknowledge:

"1) Their obligations under the terms of their supply licence. Admit, in writing, that you're obligated to make a reasonable effort at pairing a consumer access device with a smart meter.

2) That it is possible to pair this particular consumer access device (EnergyHive, can also be branded Hildebrand or Labrador), firmware version 0.8.6, with the Sscure Meters.

3) That I as a customer actually asked for something perfectly achieveable

4) That Ovo, shall we say, consistently made it more difficult than it could have been to communicate with the appropriate individuals within Ovo who could resolve the issues, and indeed communicated a number of what transpired to be false statements in the process

5) That Ovo have learned from this and promise not to do it again

and that Ovo would:

A) Turn over all internal meeting minutes, internal and externals correspondence, and call recordings to XXX at BEIS (not myself) such that they make take a view on changes that may be needed to expedite the delivery of useful smart metering in the UK

😎 Commit to enacting a formal process by which consumers may request that an "pre-approved [by Ovo] consumer access device" is paired with their smart meter within 2 weeks of first requesting this; and having this process documented online and in operation by 31/08/2018"


Ovo replied with:

"Good morning Mr Cosic

Thank you for your patience whilst your complaint was investigated.

Following your conversation with XXX on LinkedIn, I can confirm that your Consumer Access Device (CAD) has been paired, and your complaint has been closed.

If you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to get in touch. You can contact us by replying to this email, or emailing feedback@ovoenergy.com directly. You can also call the Complaints team on 0800 408 6699, our lines are open 9am-7.30pm Monday to Thursday and 9am-6pm on Friday.

Kind regards

Stacey Seeley​
Complaint Resolution Agent"


Thus ignoring every reasonable request in the complaint and attempting to brush it under the carpet on their systems.


The smart metering folk there are ok. The front line consumer facing folks are good sports too. The upper echelons appear have adopted the kind of comfortable "treat the consumer with total contempt" approach that the media would have you believe was exclusive to the Big Six. If you refuse to be bullied by them a consumer can pair their own consumer access device though.


PDF this whilst it still exists here. 😉

Saved, just incase they remove this post, it is a shame they did not fully respond and formally clarify their position. Still upshot is that the device can be paired. I shall look into grabbing one a repeating your process (hopefully with less aggravation).

Nice one redwood, keep us up to date. Hopefully the process is more streamlined for you and we can start ordering more CAD's