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Rank 2
January 21, 2025
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Zubadan shows consumed hot water energy bigger than delivered hot water energy

  • January 21, 2025
  • 41 replies
  • 755 views

Hello! We have recently installed a 12kw Zubadan air heat pump in nov2024. I am not happy with the usage as we used thermostats and it consumed too much - but this is another topic. The issue now is that in january the consumed hot water energy is bigger than the delivered hot water energy: consumed DHW - 186 delivered DHW - 141. How is this possible? I don’t know how the settings are done for hot water, but this not seems physically possible. 
We have the model with the 200l hydrotank inside.

Best answer by juliamc

I think what you’re seeing with the flow and return temperatures is the heat pump cycling.

This graph shows an example of cycling on an Ecodan of a similar size to yours, its from a government trial which I was on.

The red and green lines show the flow and return temperatures. Cycling results in a poor COP and is a symptom of an oversized heat pump.

 

Your thermistor reading for TH1A is 26 deg, which I believe is the current room temperature, so I’m not sure why the heating is running at all when you took your previous photos. ​I need @M.isterW for more info on the heating WD curve etc.

41 replies

MoranaAuthor
Rank 2
January 22, 2025

I hope these are ok:
 

 

juliamc
Rank 20
Rank 20
January 22, 2025

It doesn’t appear to have much airflow around the outdoor unit. Also the only output from that seems to be the item covered in white tape. Where is the primary pipe work ?!
I’m no expert so perhaps someone might comment on the red vessel next to the indoor unit. On my system that’s at the very highest point in the pipework.

Meanwhile maybe another heat pump owner could see what’s what here. ​@M.isterW ?

M.isterW
Rank 6
Rank 6
January 22, 2025

The energy produced figures on Mitsubishi units are complete rubbish unless you have additional energy monitoring equipment installed.

 

I agree with Julia about the outdoor unit. It's too close to the surrounding walls so it could be pulling the cold exhaust back into the unit. That will reduce the efficiency.

1992 4 bed detached house. Solar PV + battery, Zappi EV charger, Mitsubishi Ecodan ASHP and i-life2 fan assisted radiators.... No gas 😊
MoranaAuthor
Rank 2
January 23, 2025

Hello! We switched for one day on on wheater compensation curve..and it’s worse. The pump is constanly working wich I understand that is ok..but it consumed a lot, the temperature in the house is sometimes 25-26 degrees and the cop is even poorer. 
It consumed 54 and delivered 58.. and the wheater was mild, 0 to 9 degrees outside yesterday…something is very wrong.

Also checked the entire household consumed electricity, we don’t have separate for the pump, and I think the total  figure for consumed energy is about right..so it might display nonsense for hot water, but the total is not far from true…

How can it work with a cop of just 1.07 on compensation curve? I am so dispapointed, I thought this will help us fix the cop issue…

It doesn’t appear to have much airflow around the outdoor unit. Also the only output from that seems to be the item covered in white tape. Where is the primary pipe work ?!
I’m no expert so perhaps someone might comment on the red vessel next to the indoor unit. On my system that’s at the very highest point in the pipework.

Meanwhile maybe another heat pump owner could see what’s what here. ​@M.isterW ?

I don’t know what is primary pipe work..can you please give more info? The indoor and outdoor units are communicating just through that white hose, it is a split Zubadan, maybe that is why.

 

 

M.isterW
Rank 6
Rank 6
January 23, 2025

It's only the "energy produced" figures that are incorrect so you can't calculate COP from.the figures on the controller (unless you have additional energy monitoring equipment attached to the system).

 

It sounds like your weather compensation curve hasn't been set up properly. It's overheating your house so you need to lower the curve. There are guides online that show how to do this.

 

Weather compensation works by providing water into your heating system that is just hot enough to heat your house to the required temperature. When it's colder outside you need warmer water going into the heating system. The weather compensation curve tells the system what temperature the water should be for any outside temperature. Your house was too hot so your curve is too high (it's telling the heat pump to provide water that's too hot). Heat pumps are more efficient the lower the temperature they run at so having the curve too high will make the efficiency worse.

1992 4 bed detached house. Solar PV + battery, Zappi EV charger, Mitsubishi Ecodan ASHP and i-life2 fan assisted radiators.... No gas 😊
juliamc
Rank 20
Rank 20
January 23, 2025

Ah ! Sorry. If it’s a split system it’s just refrigerant flowing between the indoor and outdoor units, so they would be a lot thinner than I was expecting to see.. In fact that’s what my Daikin is !! 
 

Re the weather curve on the Ecodan/Zubadan system: ​@M.isterW , I think we’ve discussed before where the indoor temperature is measured - maybe a portable wireless device, but I can’t remember the details. ​@Morana do you have anything like a separate thermostat as part of your new system ?  Where is the indoor equipment shown in your photo ? If it’s taking the indoor temperature from that it would muddle up the desired room temperature. You mentioned previously that you use thermostats but that’s another topic, maybe it would be useful to look into that here.

MoranaAuthor
Rank 2
January 23, 2025

 

Re the weather curve on the Ecodan/Zubadan system: ​@M.isterW , I think we’ve discussed before where the indoor temperature is measured - maybe a portable wireless device, but I can’t remember the details. ​@Morana do you have anything like a separate thermostat as part of your new system ?  Where is the indoor equipment shown in your photo ? If it’s taking the indoor temperature from that it would muddle up the desired room temperature.

No, we don’t have those Mitsubishi sensors for indoor temperature, I know that those are needed if you want to use Auto Adapt function for Mitsubishi and cap the inside temp….we were instead told to buy some Salus thermostats and use it with them. But with that poor COP we decided 2 days ago to remove the thermostats that cannot be used for Auto Adaptive and only use wheater compensation...and it went worse 😥 Now we did a change in the weather compensation, the pump is finally stopped for now (aprox 25 degress in the entire house, too hot, outside 10) 

 

juliamc
Rank 20
Rank 20
January 23, 2025

Phew !! That sounds like progress 🙂. How hot is the hot water ?

juliamc
Rank 20
Rank 20
January 23, 2025

I see the value for THW5 A and B (for DHW tank water temperature) is 48 deg which is similar to mine. Can you see the values for these:

 

MoranaAuthor
Rank 2
January 23, 2025

Wow, before continuing I want to thank you for your answers, you are all so nice people here. I am not used of asking a question on the internet and actually someone really help me…

Here are the photos with the summary of settings; we mainly use hot water for baths at night, and a bit in the morning, so maybe there is another way to setup the water tank heating…