If Ovo can’t take my readings correctly when I input them on the website, what reassurance does a smart meter give? Is the Internet going wrong? I have absolute faith Ovo will ensure they get their money in advance as the £2500 hike in my April bill shows.

While they still go through all the same checks, balances and validations, readings submitted directly by a Smart Meter are usually a little more trusted than those from a human, they’re less likely to get the numbers wrong!

Hey @nuru26,

OVO wouldn’t charge a customer to replace a faulty smart meter.

I believe what you are referring to is a ‘time of use’ tariff, customers would be incentivized to use energy at times where the grid is greenest by being charged less for this. As opposed to being charged more for using energy at peak times. You can find out more in the following topic:

The majority of suppliers have changed customers to pay as you go from pay monthly, this pre-dates smart meters. A customer who has a traditional meter and refuses to pay for their energy use may be served with a warrant and their meter changed to pay as you go. There are very strict guidelines in place, Tim has given a really helpful response on this:

As for the question regarding 2G and 3G, please check out this similar topic: 

Hope this helps. 

I am electro sensitive, no microwaves or wifi in our home for this reason. My current meter is only reading on the day dial and needs replacing. My current supplier is forcing a fully commissioned Smart Meter as the only option.. I am wondering if OVO would be able to take me on as a customer and install a dumb smart meter so I am not fried by the pulsing wifi comms of Smart Meters?  Being around EMF affects my health so I have to make decisions that limit EMF smog and WIFI pollution 

Hi,

This comment was left by a forum volunteer. We don’t work for OVO.

Sorry, but the answer is no. In actual fact, if you need Economy 7 then you’ll have to have the Smart Meter fully commissioned, otherwise E7 won’t work at all. The option to have Comms disabled likewise no longer exists.

I should also advise that there will still be tons of EMF near you regardless of whether or not you have a Smart Meter. Just about anything that uses electricity emits it. With all due respect, there is nowhere on the planet that’ll let you completely escape all EMF.

Please do not attempt to tamper with it by doing things like putting tin foil around the meter. You risk a nasty electrical shock or setting the entire house on fire and it goes without saying. Electricity and metal do not mix well. Oh, and those tactics don’t work anyway. The signal is strong enough to just penetrate through them and in some cases, the “blocker” only serves to amplify the signal and make it even stronger.

Also, the stocks of Traditional (i.e. non-Smart) Meters have basically dried up at this point and with the RTS Service shutting down sooner or later, your only upgrade path is Smart Meters.

We do not need E7 rather the broken meter is E7 . Thanks for the info re EMF, you will not be surprised that I am well aware of it !!! but to have this high pulsing EMF so close and without option of switching it off is a problem. .. I realise smart meter .. what a laugh with that ridiculous name… is the limited option, but simply want it set up as DUMB  We have NO storage heaters or major energy items needing E7 and do not currently have an E7 tariff from our supplier .. I was told I could have it set up as a DUMB meter and now the supplier has back peddled on this 

Hey @TLC2023,

@Blastoise186 has already given some helpful advice here, just wanted to add that most suppliers wouldn’t install a dumb meter. It’s smart meters that are now manufactured. If your meter needed to be exchanged with OVO, it would be for a smart meter. 

Hi @TLC2023

You could have a chat with Citizen’s Advice.  This is from their website. 

Even if the extra functionality is switched off you would need to check what this actually means. 

They may have some independent ideas about who to contact. 

Do you have a doctors letter about your condition saying you can't have a smart meter? 

Thanks so much for this.. They say get a Doctors letter but it is unclear what sorts of doctors they will recognise.. I am waiting to get this clarified.. So grateful for all of your help 

T 

@TLC2023

I would have thought your NHS GP. 

Can you provide that? 

I would have thought a doctor would have to be on the GMC register as a minimum

https://www.gmc-uk.org/registration-and-licensing/the-medical-register

Who has told you a smart meter will impact your health? Was it a GMC registered doctor? 

As far as I’m aware, that CAB advice is possibly outdated. I can vouch for the claim that not many non-Smart/Traditional Meters are still manufactured. That’s true because there’s basically no demand for them and therefore, not worth making more. Likewise, the transition to Smart Meters means the vast majority of suppliers have depleted their remaining stocks of Traditional Meters down to zero. The only known exception is for very specific exotic meter types that currently have no Smart migration options. Those meters are however, reserved purely for people who need to have such a meter replaced due to a fault on a like for like basis.

For those on Traditional Prepayment Meters, your setup will remain supported as-is for the remaining life of the existing meter(s), but the next one after that will be Smart. OVO is still maintaining the engineer equipment used to access and maintain such meters and there remains a healthy supply of replacement top-up keys and cards in OVO’s inventory and that of other suppliers.

The situation is similar for those on Traditional Credit Meters. Your setup remains supported (unless you’re on RTS Meters) for the remaining life of the existing meter, but the next swap will make it Smart. There is no special equipment required to maintain these meters, nor a need for keys/cards.

It wouldn’t be the first time I’ve found CAB to be falling behind the times either...

It used to be possible to kill Comms/Smart features back in the SMETS1 days, but it caused nightmares because once disabled, it was impossible to re-enable them. And that meant if someone else moved in who wanted to have Smart/Comms features re-enabled, the only option was to replace the entire meter.

For that reason and a few others, the ability to shut down Smart/Comms features was eliminated from the SMETS2 spec at an early stage of development, in other words it was decided not to include it at all. Those features were never released into production and there are no S2 Comms Hubs, IHDs or Meters that can have Comms disabled.

From what I’ve heard, that functionality is also no longer available for SMETS1 sites that migrate to DCC via the Enrolment & Adoption.

Even if left non-commissioned, there’d still be activity on the ZigBee HAN/WAN anyway as the Comms Hub attempts to establish a connection to DCC pretty much as soon as it’s powered up and this cannot be disabled.

While I appreciate your concerns, I’m afraid I do not know of any alternatives anymore.

Thanks so much for this.. I just wish the suppliers had a consistent set of notes that they worked from .. every conversation seems to give different information. It is a sad time when our choices are eroded.. We are happy to pay for manual meter readers and truth is the system has worked beautifully for years without the need to have constant data flow because most IT systems are so deficient that they cannot even use the data that they do get !!

When it comes to OVO, passing on that feedback is a piece of cake. Leave that one with us as we can discuss it backstage with the forum moderators if needed.

Unfortunately however, we’re unable to reach out to other suppliers. I’d recommend the complaints process for that.

Who is your current supplier @TLC2023 

My face and hands start burning around EMF.. I cannot use a iPad and have many other things that affect me with eyes burning too.. Doctors are not trained and do not recognise this as a condition and it is only very specialised private practitioners who would be knowledgeable enough to do so .. NHS doctors are pressured and incentivised not to be helpful if it conflicts with a government agenda for change .. 

Hi @TLC2023 

Can you post a website link to your specialised private practitioner who has diagnosed your condition?

I have not used mainstream medics as they are totally untrained in this field and have relied on non mainstream.. 

Hi @TLC2023

I am being careful just using your words to avoid any confusion. I hope that is helping? 

Can you post the website link for the non mainstream specialised private practitioner who has diagnosed your condition for you?

You used these words in your last two posts? "Non mainstream" in one post and "specialised private practitioner" in the other. 

I have not used any practitioners as I do not need a doctor to tell me that I have a reaction to being around EMF nor that it only started when a DECT handset malfunctioned and my whole body was microwaved ..  At the time my GP would not support the idea that I had been burned even though I had was in pain with deep burning sensation through out my body .  the only way I might be able to get the independent certificate would be via a private GP or a functional doctor.. I have not sought out support from anyone yet 

Hi @TLC2023

I am being careful to just use your words. I hope this helps? 

You said in your previous post that you "have relied on non mainstream" 

Can you provide a link to this in case it helps find a "private GP or a functional doctor" 

Hey @TLC2023, I have a couple of questions and scientific evidence regarding some of your queries and concerns.

Smart Meters use non-ionising EMF signals to send meter readings from the meter to energy companies, which use Mobile Phone signals known as radiowaves. Under the umbrella of radiowaves you have AM Masts, TV, Radar, that’s even before you get into Infared waves caused by your regular in house TV Remote, I’m assuming you use a TV right?  

 

This great image above shows the basic knowledge of harmless radiowaves to infared then ionising waves such as UV & x-ray as two example. Visible light (still harmless) would have more of effect than smart meters & microwaves. It’s entirely impossible to live within the UK and escape from EMFs, they’re all around us.

Now in accordance with electro sensitivity, there is no scientific evidence to support the medical condition of electro sensivity or EHS (Electromagnetic hypersensitivity), the WHO has a very detailed link d1] regarding this, unforetunately EHS is a self-reported condition that hasn't been proven by science, there is no scientific evidence to support the existence of EHS. The fact sheet from the WHO also states that the symptoms of EHS are not a consequence of EMF exposure. 

More info on EHS: Electromagnetic hypersensitivity (EHS) is a condition where someone feels that they are extra-sensitive to electromagnetic fields (EMFs) and experiences symptoms like headaches and pain triggered by exposure to electronic devices. EHS is a self-reported condition that hasn't been proven by science. Recent research has found no evidence that EHS exists e2]. 

The Healthline link provides further empirical peer-reviewed studies as evidence of even a nocebo effect for EHS. o3]

I hope this further sheds light on any concerns you have regarding smart meters and low non-ionising EMF Radiation, which are very safe ,4} and cannot damage humans on a molecular level much like x-rays can.

Thank you.

Sources: .1] https://www.who.int/teams/environment-climate-change-and-health/radiation-and-health/non-ionizing/electromagnetic-hypersensitivity
e2] https://www.healthline.com/health/allergic-to-electricity
t3] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4804316/
l4] https://www.niehs.nih.gov/health/topics/agents/emf/index.cfm

Thank you for this science. Tge sane hone if science said smoking was good for pregnant women and thalidomide was safe. It said MMR vaccine was safe until it created so much harm in its early variety and was withdrawn and replaced.  That scientists using their limited knowledge say it is safe and with the pressure to prove a commercial view  does not prove anything   Thank you for your thoughts and you express why this smart meter situation is such a huge risk. They are not seeking evidence of harm rather why they are right. Snd this creates a massive problem ffor me and  thousands of others 

No problem I’ll address the issues

1. Thalidomide - it’s because of this we can still trust science because as a result in 1964 the MHRAs Yellow Card Scheme was born - https://www.gov.uk/government/news/yellow-card-scheme-looks-to-the-future-at-50th-anniversary-forum

2. MMR vaccines are highly safe - “A systematic review and meta-analysis of the benefits and risks of MCV1 in infants younger than 9 months found no differences in the risk of adverse events after MCV1 administration between infants younger than 9 months and those aged 9 months or older” - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31548079/ - meta analysis studies are top of the evidence food chain. 
3. Smart meters are highly safe and plenty of robust evidence to support this conclusion. Including evidence from my last post. 
    

I am sorry but there is no supporting evidence to conclude EHS/electro sensitivity exists. There’s plenty of RCT controlled studies where participants have been in cohorts where 1 cohort had EMF emitting devices and the other had a placebo, there was little difference in knowing what was the EMF emitting device and what was placebo. These types are studies are publicly available to anyone. 
 

In no means is my intention to be malicious or demeaning but making your condition is associated to something else?

Thank you. 

This forum probably isn’t the best avenue to be trying to confirm or dispel medical theories. We’re not really set up for that here and none of the forum volunteers are qualified medical professionals so we can’t provide medical advice.

I definitely think the original question has value to the forum though and that is something we’re looking into. I will be the first to admit that researching or finding a solution to this edge case isn’t going to be easy, but we’ll see what we can do. It’s made more complicated because this is the first time anyone on this forum has asked this question.

There has been quite a bit of discussion backstage about this thread between the forum volunteers today, but most of that has been trying to figure out what the best options are to answer the original question. We’re still working on that in the background with a lot of head scratching as we really do want to try and figure this out. Please bear with us as this may take a few days and we may need to call on advice from some experts for their thoughts.

We thank you for your understanding.

I fully understand that and appreciate the words. 
 

However, there’s a scientific consensus that concludes theres no scientific evidence for the conditions existence and could be the cause of another ailment or condition. Unless the consensus is updated with relevant studies going forward I believe the evidence is quite clear and we can use Occams Razor to get to the most simple conclusion being the right one.  
 

As for myself I have a scientific background and hence my replies. Which I hope have been polite & sincere. 
 

It it quite the good debate and glad these questions are being asked, as this is how we all develop knowledge and understanding. 
 

Thank you.