Complex meter: Refused Economy 7?

Hi Ben_OVO

Thank for your help and the link to EDF RTS switch off.

I had visited this link before but your reply prompted me to read it again.

Their statement “and we’ve made sure there’s a suitable meter available for every type of set up” has them scratching their heads when it comes to mine. What they print and what you hear when speaking to them do not match up.

They have informed me that they are looking into it so I wait with baited breath.

Hi BPLightlog

Thank you also for looking at this. You are correct about each single phase feed to the distribution boards.

I definitely think that there will be a requirement for some wiring alterations unless a suitable meter can be found. The main concern here is the 24hr economy supply which is the control circuit for all heating. If that has to be moved to the standard domestic tariff its going to be a huge increase in my annual bill. But if that is the only way to maintain the control side I am going to have to suck it up.

Hi again ​@Koolqat and thanks for your help here ​@BPLightlog, much appreciated as always!

​@Koolqat I’ve double checked behind the scenes and can confirm that we’re not taking on new customers with complex metering setups at the moment, however this may change soon! I’ve also had one of our engineers cast their eyes over your photos, and they’ve advised that, if you were our customer, we’d most likely be able to get it changed over successfully. I appreciate that this doesn’t help too much, as you’re not able to sign up to OVO at the moment but, hopefully, EDF should be able to get this sorted for you soon.

I don’t know the ins and outs of EDF’s RTS process at the moment, but they’re one of the biggest UK energy suppliers, so hopefully they should have some engineers that’ll be able to get your supply changed over. Let us know how it goes and please do feel free to fire any more questions our way.

Thanks again Ben_OVO, that information sounds a little more promising. Hopefully the next time that EDF send an engineer he will have been appraised of the system he will be attending to.

It wasn’t for the lack of information that I have provided to them prior to the last visit. They have the same photographs that I posted so if they give them to their engineers they might have a chance.

I will still monitor OVO to see if they start taking on new customers with systems like mine and will probably make the switch.

Are these night storage heaters? There are different types, with older ones often having two feeds, one for charging them with offpeak electricity, the other for control. Many modern ones have a single feed, but internal time switches ensure that they are only charged during offpeak periods. In both cases, almost all of the energy they use can be managed by a smart meter to be billed at offpeak rates. It sounds as if a meter like one or other of the Aclara SGM 1430-B variants will be able to manage this (other brands are available!). What you lose is the 24-hour lower-cost heating supply, so you’d pay full whack for any other heaters running out of offpeak hours. 

Sadly, EDF seem to have decided against continuing complex tariffs like Economy 10 which would suit customers in that situation, giving 10 hours offpeak for charging up storage heaters and heating water. It’s also convenient with daytime offpeak hours where power-hungry equipment can be used at lower rates. OVO are also a bit conflicted about taking on new complex-metering customers, but they can possibly be persuaded.

EDF are now apparently only be offering Economy 7 for customers with storage heating, so no daytime cheap power They may reconsider, or face losing a lot of customers who they regard as awkward. 

Hi Firedog thank you for your contribution.

I have 5 storage heaters (Dimplex Quantum) which were installed as replacements for old storage heaters in January 2022. These are charged overnight with off peak energy. These are very efficient storage heaters only drawing what they need. They are very well insulated and do not leak any heat. These heaters  require a second power source (24hr) to run the fan that distributes the heat for when programmed. They can be controlled from a Dimplex hub via smart phone controlling zone temperatures or individual spaces.

I also have 6 panel heaters which have 24hr supply and like the storage heaters can be programmed and controlled from a smart phone.

Water heating is off peak but it can also be boosted if required from the 24hr supply.

Having been on the same type of tariff for over 25 years it has come as a bit of a shock that these tariffs are becoming obsolete. All the more for the energy suppliers I suppose.

Using over 19,000 units a year even with the old tariff did not come cheap but it is an excellent heating system.

I do have a gas meter and was considering changing to a wet system with a gas boiler but we really don’t want to go through the upheaval of a major change. It is looking more likely that some rewiring is going have to be the way to go.

This is what I was referring to. On a two-rate tariff, the peak price is quite a bit higher than the single-rate price. Using panel heaters injudiciously could be very expensive indeed. Your Quantums are the ones to rely on, using panel heaters only for an extra comfort boost, during offpeak hours only whenever possible.

Your water heater will work in exactly the same way as before. Using its boost function out of offpeak hours is to be avoided, but it shouldn’t often be necessary.   

If the consumer unit(s) are anywhere near the meter, it may be possible for the meter engineer to do what’s necessary to connect the storage heaters and immersion heater up as required. It will often just be a question of shuffling stuff around in the CU, but every installation is unique, so we can’t be certain. If the engineer can’t finish that part of the job off, it would probably take only a brief visit by your friendly neighbourhood electrician to do the necessary. 

I wonder if ​@Lukepeniket_OVO can take a look into this for you ​@Koolqat & offer some helpful avice here. 
 

Have you considered air to air heating using an ASHP?

Hugely popular in Shetland for replacing storage heaters with a more efficient controllable system, even folk with Quantums are removing them for air to air heating. 

No government assistance, as they can also work to cool the properties through summer, but VAT is 0%, and much cheaper/easier to install than an air to water ASHP. Also way simpler than air to water ASHP.

Can give you more info if required, installed our system August last year.

There are rumours that this may change according to several recent articles, e.g. UK homeowners could get £7,500 grant for air con heat pumps | The Standard. This would perhaps be well worth waiting for ...