OVO does have a VERY limited stock of replacements for exotic meters. However, it’s definitely not an infinite supply in a bottomless vault so they will eventually run out. But I’m not sure how many are left or if I can query the stocks...

So just off phone, I think this is what they’ll try to do and send an engineer to replace broken standard meter like for like, the pickle being how quickly they can get over to us.

They WILL NOT remove/disconnect or replace the THTC meter even if I pay them.

They will not allow me to get an engineer of my own to disconnect/remove it and if I do it will be illegal tampering.

They will not install a smart meter as they say none exist currently that can serve an MPN17 Highlands/Islands area.

There is no cheaper tariff available.

I cannot switch supplier as nobody will have me due to the THTC being in place.

I am just to take their word for it what my usage is till the broken meter is replaced (the engineer will ‘read’ the broken meter when he comes…till then I will be accruing an unknown amount of debt)

Theres no definitive dates for any of this being resolved, but within the year all meters will be Smart, the signal will turn off and THTC meters will be removed. Apparently. 
Till then OVO have me trapped! I’m paying 30p per unit (700 units pcm) and 24p per unit (80 units pcm) plus 56p per day (dropping to 26 &20 on April first…at which point I assume the standing charge will simply go up!  

I can get a tracker tariff averaging 13p elsewhere if it weren’t for the THTC meter!

Thanks all for your help & insider info, at least I’ll get another old meter installed at some point…hopefully before it’s time to uninstall it all when the signal goes off!

Been a right old uphill battle for you, to replace a broken bit of kit that wasn’t even your fault…oh well, take care and hope it gets resolved quickly for you. 

Hey @zedzedhoney,

I’m sorry, it’s a very frustrating situation.

Please keep us posted with how the replacement for the non THTC meter goes. At least this means you’ll be billed accurately.

As soon as there are any changes on the THTC meter issue, I’ll update advice on all related topics. 

Thanks! I really hope so, it’s tricky as our ferry situation is catastrophic so I’m told by locals that it’s not straightforward like a mainland engineer would be and that Ovo may need to call a company called SMS via People’s Energy as they fit meters on island for any company…is there a way you could pass this on to the correct person please? 
 

My biggest frustration is that there’s no dates for any of this and I’m not going to be free to hunt for the best deal for my family’s needs (we have two kids with disabilities and need to run washer/dryers daily to keep them clean/safe).

And one thing I’ve noticed from your excellent photos @zedzedhoney is that your meter in your first photo showed Rate 1 000 18 (with a gap between digit 3 and 4) and then in a subsequent photo showed Rate 1 00036 (no gap)…maybe, with a bit of luck, the meter is  still allowing you to track your consumption till things get sorted?  Assuming rate 1 is your normal tariff, not sure why the gap, though!  
 

All the very best, please do let us know how things progress, you’ve got us rather on tenterhooks now and I’m rooting for you with all my fingers crossed!

Do the readings on the meter in your first photo line up with the previous reads on the account @zedzedhoney?

Hi @Emmanuelle_OVO I’m not sure as the last few have been estimates, they definitely didn’t say 00018 though, but I do know that in November and December we manually read it and was in the late 9 thousands so it maybe tripped over to 99999 and that sent it back to zero and also loopy? 
 

Im so confused by this whole THTC situation as other people keep saying I can just get it disconnected and have a smart meter (albeit not fully smart in our area) installed by another supplier, but that seems to be exactly the opposite of what OVO and this forum know to be true!

Just checked, 98278 was their last estimate in Feb, so bears no relation to the 00018 on the display.

If you have actual readings from November and December (and January too?), it shouldn’t be too difficult to extrapolate to find out whether it’s likely the meter has tripped over 99999 and started again from 0. What are the latest readings you have?

Yeah we were in that back in pg1of this saga! It was 97735 on Dec 6th, then estimates, so yes tripping over 99999 is likely…sadly the meter is no longer recording accurately and is flashing on and off…so it’s definitely not functioning… but the real issue is that I can’t get it replaced with a smart meter, and can’t get the functioning THTC meter disconnected from it, can’t switch supplier with a THTC ‘exotic’ meter in place, can’t get it removed, can’t get a better tariff, and now can’t accurately record my actual usage on the standard meter until it’s replaced with a ‘new heritage’(old/used) meter, even though I don’t want an old style meter or a THTC meter, or to be paying 30p a unit or go wait an unspecified time till it’s replaced while unknown amounts of debt build up on a non-functioning meter I have no access to usage info on!

Sorry, I should perhaps crawl back into my hole 

I’d just say that I think your supplier has a statutory duty to provide a working meter, and it certainly looks as if that one has given up the will to live (000 18 is probably an error code, but I can’t find any documentation to indicate what it might mean). OVO can’t just leave you with an unmetered supply until they work out what to do about H&I THTC customers. Make sure you have details of the readings you’ve taken over the past couple of years, because that’s the only basis there will be for estimating your usage since the meter stopped working.

No stay out of your hole and come play in the Hell I’m in please! Sadly we only moved in in June, then we were migrated from SSE to Ovo and so we only have 3months of meter readings. 
Im hoping we’ll come to some agreement re fair estimates based on what the rest of the market says about average usage for this number of occupants etc, They also said the meter will be fixed and ‘read’ not sure how if it’s faulty but as it’s still consuming maybe there’s a way to get info from it…perhaps with a sonic screwdriver…not that I’ll be trusting those readings much! 

I’m not sure estimates based on other people’s usage is good enough…if your supplier wants to present you with a bill, then they have to have the correct machinery in place.  None of this is your fault.  
 

It may well be that the meter is logging your usage, even if the consumer can’t read it. Let’s hope so!
 

And that’s without you claiming compensation for all the worry and hassle and incompetence…

Hey @zedzedhoney,

I’ve asked about this internally and been advised SMS do have stock of THTC meters, so a meter exchange can be booked in like for like. 

It won’t be a smart meter, but it’s some progress. 

But the snag is how to get that over to the Isle of Arran. It’s about 418 miles and over eight hours drive away from OVO’s head office and that ferry doesn’t look very frequent...

Thanks @Emmanuelle_OVO but again, it’s not the THTC meter (that I don’t want) that is broken, it’s the standard meter which is broken! But I’m told the exotic THTC meter works WITH the standard meter so when the broken standard meter is replaced with an old one it will still be connected to the THTC whic runs my hot water (again I don’t want this but Ovo will not remove/disconnect the functioning THTC meter and no other provider will take me as a customer until you do)

Yup! I’m told this will be contracted out to a company that installs meters for Ovo on the islands…but I’m not sure. I mean the ferry is pants but there’s at least 3 theoretical ferries over per day and we get Royal Mail/Amazon/Evri so they can just post the meter for an on island installer or just send a local bloke over with his tools under his arm!

Okay I’m glad to hear this has been contracted out to someone who can do the work for you. Please keep us posted with how you get on @zedzedhoney it’s a very unique and complex situation you’re in! If you haven’t heard anything within 3 weeks please let us know and I’ll see if Forum_Support can chase an update for you.

It’s going to be interesting to see whether the problem has been linked to the meter clicking over from a total tariff (Rate 1) of 9999 to 0000. It could be some entirely different problem, of course, linked to an ageing meter, or simply a random failure in this particular meter. 
 

But if there is an inherent failure waiting to happen, might there not be a fair few of these elderly Siemens meters still in use up and down the Country, coming to the end of their faithful service? They can’t all be waiting to keel over if and when they reach a reading of 9999.99 kWh, surely? If so, I assume that could happen for some which, like in this instance, are dual rate and have their second rate, for a little while longer, tied to a THTC meter?

Never ending saga continues, this now consumes my day!

Currently Ovo have asked a company called SMS to install a meter. SMS say they can install a smart meter and do away with the THTC, but Ovo previously said this was impossible, their best suggestion was having a heritage meter supplied for the faulty standard one and a single tariff since our biggest spend is our regular meter. No idea how to proceed.

SMS proposed fitting an SMETS2 E7 Meter an Off Peak Tariff for the hot water (from 12am to 7am)

My many questions included:

*This appears to be dual tariff again not single?

*How would a cheaper tariff at night benefit us regarding the hot water system...doesn't it currently heat the water when it's USED, so as the tank empties and refills with cold water the sensor reacts by turning the heating element on to raise the temp...this wouldn't specifically happen at night? We don't want it to become an expensive immersion heater that is constantly on.

*What would the two dual tariff costs and standing charge be?

*Are economy 7 meters going to continue to be supported or are they being phased out?

*I'm not a plumber and I assume the meter installer isn't either, so not sure how the water heater will be rerouted from the THTC and made to function on demand as it does now?
*Would I be able to swap provider with this meter?

Meanwhile Ovo continues to ‘handle’ my complaint which is mostly me not understanding wth is going on and why I should be paying estimates for a non-functional meter!

PLEASE HELP ME AS I DON’T KNOW WHAT YO DO RE THESE METERS!

Hi @zedzedhoney, sorry to hear of the ongoing saga!

And, in general terms, be reassured, SMS are the folk to fit a smart meter. 

I can help with several of your queries, taking them seriatim:

1.  It would indeed be a dual tariff that seems to be the suggestion here.

2.  Not sure about the hot water/immersion time of use to suit yourself; is it a tank with heating element, that can be lagged and well insulated, could you use it as a big immersion heater, timed to heat only between 12 and 7? Or is it, as sounds more likely, some kind of instant on demand water heater? If the latter, you're quite right, dual tariff wouldn't really help in normaI daily use I think.
3. The standing charge won't cost any more with having dual tariff.
4. The cost of the two tariffs and the SC can be found out by (once more!) chatting to OVO
5. There are many on here well versed with Economy7, and someone will soon respond… but this is also something you could query with OVO
6. The change of wiring to your water heater would not necessarily involve a plumber at all, simply connecting the existing heater cable to the new meter rather than the old meter. Whether said cable is long enough etc. is more of an electrician’s problem than a plumber to ponder, so far as I can tell?
7. You would find it easier to swap provider with the new smart meter...but every provider has different tariffs, and dual tariffs could maybe be a sticking point when seeking to switch? But in itself, no problem about switching after a smart meter has been fitted. 

So, pending further, more pertinent, advice from forum members on your dual tariff requirements (or not) and the whole Economy7 side of things, you could start preparing a list of queries to OVO customer services, now that at last you have encouraging news about a SMETS meter being a real possibility: namely, the practicalities of Economy7 for your situation and your particular heater, and the tariff costs of said dual tariff if it is practicable in the first place.

Good luck, things are progressing for you on the metering front, even though it might not feel like that! It's this water heating problem that needs definitive answers before you can feel confident about proceeding, I know. 

Thanks for reply, will need to disseminate later when I’ve more time as lots of great info thanks…it’s my birthday and I’m determined to spend some of it NOT on this issu…and yes I’m chatting to OVO many times a day, but they seem not to be chatting with SMS much so are still on the heritage meter/single tariff loop…I’ve no idea who to ask about the water heater as it seems to be nobody’s job! SMS just replied saying it’s simply my choice what meter I want….but not answering any questions re the water (which I need an answer to before choosing) so it’s obviously not their job!

Walt has made a lot of valid points. 

I’d ask - how big is that high-tech water tank? What model number is it? I counted 38 different models on their product literature page, so it’s impossible to guess.

How much hot water do you use each day?

I’ll look it up again, but I think you should be able to charge it up overnight to give you enough hot water for the day, so long as there aren’t too many of you needing hot baths each day. My 210 litre tank lasts for two or three days on a single night’s charge, but there’s only one of me.

Whatever is currently connected to the THTC meter would be connected to the fifth port on the smart meter, meaning (if they get it right) that there would only be power to them at night. We can’t be sure that this will suit you until we know more about the water tank. This looks like the only potential stumbling block on your way to a solution.

Happy birthday to you  

What is your water heater for? Handbasin level filling or larger - like a bath full?

Or post a picture of the water heater and we might have a better idea