Are Economy 10 tariffs available yet?

This is really an eye-opener. We’ve been hearing repeatedly that ‘it can’t be done’, with various fanciful explanations, including from OVO metering experts, yet you seem to have succeeded when so many others have failed. Until you revealed where you live, I was prepared to put your anomalous experience down to having a different DNO, but you’re just round the corner from Mike (@MikeMilf), so bang goes that theory. You may also have a different type of meter and/or comms hub.

I’m tempted to ask you to post all sorts of details about your set-up, so the other less fortunate customers in this thread and others can use them as a stick to beat OVO about the head with. If you could find a moment to assemble them, it might help a lot of currently dissatisfied customers who have just about reached their wits’ end.

1. A screenshot of your Plan page showing the name of the tariff, its timings (hidden behind the 🛈 button) and the rates. 
2. A photo of your meter, including its top and tails. The top is usually where the comms hub is, but it might be a separate box. The tails are the wires coming out of the bottom.
3. The tricky bit: your sanitized meter configuration file. Mike was able to follow these instructions on his Windows computer back in August, when his saga first made its debut in this forum:
    

   While signed in to your account (e.g while viewing the readings page), open a new tab in the same browser session and visit this page:  smartpaymapi.ovoenergy.com/orex/api/supply-points/account/1234567  substituting your own account number for the last seven characters in that URL.  With any luck, this will show you a page with JSON data about your meter. It may be an impenetrable mess, or if you’re lucky it may be quite legible - it depends on your browser’s capabilities. This is what my E7 configuration looks like in Edge:       Each meter register is called a “tier”, each with its own number,  “timeOfUseLabel” (TOU) and  “timePatternRegime” (TPR). Make a note of these details.

This may be enough to help us spot why your system is working as expected while so many others aren’t. I’m sure you’ve got nothing better to do the next few days 😉

@Firedog Happy to provide that. You have already helped me over on 

so very glad I can contribute back.

I feel there is a slight risk it will reveal that I am actually on E7, but if so, good to know. I think not because I average 24.x/kWh, and my peak rate is 30.x/kWh, and I am not using much power overnight. 

Anyway, I am having a quiet Christmas, so I may do it tomorrow or - ahem - Monday, as I call it.

I take my hat off to you 👒 if you managed to fathom my API instructions!

There’s no hurry - even if we did manage to find something in the next few days, we wouldn’t get any further until well into next month. Relax and enjoy the festive season 😊

1. 

2. 

3.       "region": "_H",
         "profileClass": "02",
         "meterType": "S2ADE",
         "mapId": "SGNS",
         "lineLossFactorClassId": "104",
         "registers": [
            {
               "tier": 1,
               "clockingTimeId": 375,
               "timeOfUseLabel": "peak",
               "meterRegisterId": "1",
               "timePatternRegime": 375,
               "measurementQuantityId": "AI",
               "switchedLoadIndicator": false,
               "meterRegisterMultiplier": 1,
               "registerMappingCoefficient": "1"
            },
            {
               "tier": 2,
               "clockingTimeId": 374,
               "timeOfUseLabel": "offpeak",
               "meterRegisterId": "2",
               "timePatternRegime": 374,
               "measurementQuantityId": "AI",
               "switchedLoadIndicator": true,
               "meterRegisterMultiplier": 1,
               "registerMappingCoefficient": "1"
            }
         ],
         "start": "2022-05-26T23:00:00.000Z",
         "end": null,
         "fuel": "Electricity",
         "meterNoOfDigitsOrDials": 5
      }
   ]

The tricky part was #2, I had to search for the key to open the meter cupboard and it’s a cold wind that blows through those gaping holes. On the bright side, I found the missing cat toy that I had looked everywhere for. And replaced 🙄

Oh, and I know JSON, so all I needed from you was the URL - thank you very much! - I could work the rest out myself, so I have no comment on your instructions.

That is brilliant - thanks so much!

This shows quite conclusively that (a) it is possible for OVO to support an E10 tariff, (b) that the (now standard for OVO for multi-rate set-ups) Aclara SGM 1416-B is capable of managing E10 timings, and that (c) there is someone in OVO’s metering team who knows how to set it all up. 

The meter config is just the same as Mike’s (SSC 935: TPR 375 peak and 374 offpeak) with the TPRs the right way round. His JSON data are here.

I suggest that @MikeMilf and @JessicaRose take note of this - I think you’re both in Region H (Southern), and you both have Aclara SGM-1416-B meters. Other than some misconfiguration of the meters before installation, I can’t see any reason why this arrangement couldn’t be made to work for you, too. There may be other SSE migrants in the same situation.

@Firedog - JSON data below.  Meter is currently switching my off peak circuit on at economy 10 times but charging peak an doff peak as per Economy 7!

100% ditto to Jessica’s situation

Have been watching tariff changes over the Christmas period and my flat is defo switching on its off peak circuits according to E10, but the IHD displays E7 peak rates at those times

With my night storage heaters needing to be used now, the 5 hours afternoon and evening are damn pricey!

Oh btw…..Ovo just processed my latest bill. After failing to bill any usage yet again, and deducting some Powermove credits, it came to…..wait for it….. 7p!! lol

I shouldnt laugh, this is a shambles and if people at Ovo know about this E10 debacle, heads should roll

Collating [three] four different config files, for two dysfunctional set-ups and one working arrangement:
  

The significant difference between Mike’s dud and Joan’s cracker is the reversed order of the tiers, which is what I drew attention to back in August - that the first tier has to be the peak register and (in these two-tier cases) the second has to be the offpeak register. 

When my own SGM 1416-B was first installed in September, it was misconfigured in just the same way, with Tier 1 for offpeak and Tier 2 for peak. That was put right remotely as soon as I made contact with someone who knew what he was talking about in the metering team. So it can be done. Joan’s set-up illustrates that OVO can handle SSC935 correctly, with Tier 1 on TPR 375 and Tier 2 on TPR 374. The timings on Joan’s plan page above show what this does.

If and when you manage to persuade OVO to make this little modification, there’s the question of the tariff. Joan seems to have migrated seamlessly on to OVO’s E10 Standard Variable Tariff (SVT), but I suspect that Mike and Jessica have been through a few variants in the past few months, sadly none of them the right ones. It should also be possible to put that right.

I’m not sure that the two items in red have any significance at all in this respect. Even if they do, they’re the same for Mike and Joan, so they’re not causing the problem Mike is facing.

I wish I knew how Mike and Jessica could take this forward, so I’ll ask backstage if there’s a way to cut through the system and get them into the hands of someone who knows. Once those two hurdles have been cleared, someone in Billing can start cleaning up the mess. That may take some time.

Meanwhile, there may be other customers in this and other threads who are in the same situation. I hope they’ll come forward here and - preferably - provide the same documentation of their situation as Joan did.
  

 [EDIT a few days later]

@pegem  has kindly shared details of his system, so I’ve added his config data to the table above. He is also on the Simpler Energy - Economy 10 plan like Joan, albeit now showing the 2024Q1 rates. Note that his meter type seems to be the one I’d expect to see: S2BDE (see the table below added on 30 December 2023).

We’ll get to the bottom of this ...

Caveat [still applies]: It may look as if I know what I’m talking about, but don’t let that fool you. 

@Firedog as always my sincere thanks for taking the time to try and help. Your summary above is probably invaluable if we get it looked at by the right people.

My formal complaint will be halfway through its eight week timescale on 04.01 and thus far Ive had  zero meanngful responses, only useless platitudes from hello@ovo then nothing. I will email complaints@ovo to remind them the clock is ticking. How can I escalate matters if need be?

I would happily spend as much time as needed on the phone if I knew the person ultimately had the authority/knowledge to do what is necessary. What Im really not prepared to do any more is spend time holding for generic CS who do nothing.

Ultimately, getting the technical matters resolved is one thing, but obtaining recompense for past overcharging will no doubt be even more challenging lol

Regardless of all this nonsense, Happy New Year all….hope its a cracker!

I’ll chip in here to say I’ve passed on internally and I’ll be back next week hopefully with something of value to add.

The members of this forum are certainly a clever bunch!  

Sorry Tim, I posted this before reading your last post! Hope you have more luck than us ordinary punters seem to have!

I had a reply from 'Tim_OVO' he said,

Thanks for forwarding that on, Pegem. I'm sorry it's not the response you had hoped for.

I can't offer advice here whilst you also have a channel of communication open with a complaint handler on the same thing. I am aware that OVO don't offer eco-10 hours for their 2 rate plans, but that smart meter customers who migrated to OVO on eco-10 would keep those times.

If your meter has been changed to eco-7 and you prefer eco-10, you might consider a switch in supplier to one which can cater to your requirements.

Hope you get the outcome you want whichever route you choose,

Tim

I replied,

Tim, I think the thing to note is your statement "but that smart meter customers who migrated to OVO on eco-10 would keep those times."

This is obviously not happening, I was a SSE customer on a Smart Meter on E10. It says so in our contract. The meter at our end is on E10 timings, but it's charging us E7 rates!

Result, 5 hours each day charged Peak when it should be off-peak!

@pegem I wonder if you’d consider documenting your current situation in the same way as three other similarly afflicted customers have done. The more datapoints we manage to assemble, the bigger the stick we have to beat OVO about the head with. This is what I asked @joanx to do, and that helped me to demonstrate that what we have repeatedly been told can’t be done has in fact been done. This is what I asked her to provide:
  

1. A screenshot of your Plan page showing the name of the tariff, its timings and the rates. 
2. A photo of your meter, including its top and tails. The top is usually where the comms hub is, but it might be a separate box. The tails are the wires coming out of the bottom.
3. The tricky bit: your sanitized meter configuration file. These instructions are for a Windows computer, but you may be able to adapt them to suit:
    

   While signed in to your account (e.g while viewing the readings page), open a new tab in the same browser session and visit this page:  smartpaymapi.ovoenergy.com/orex/api/supply-points/account/1234567  substituting your own account number for the last seven characters in that URL.  With any luck, this will show you a page with JSON data about your meter. It may be an impenetrable mess, or if you’re lucky it may be quite legible - it depends on your browser’s capabilities. This is what my E7 configuration looks like in Edge:       Each meter register is called a “tier”, each with its own number,  “timeOfUseLabel” (TOU) and  “timePatternRegime” (TPR). These dictate which register clocks usage at which times.

If they’re comparable, I could then add your data to the table in my previous post. 

I don’t know if @ajay  is still around, but if you are, you might like to chip in with your documentation, too. 

This just FYI. Feel free to ignore.

Having wasted a Saturday Googling, this is what the Meter Type entry in the config file means:
  

I don’t quite believe that they’re accurate, so I suspect they’re ignored.

‘mapid’ means Meter Asset Provider ID, I think just a cryptic abbreviation of the name of the company that leases the meter to the supplier (in these cases, OVO).
   

So, no, I don’t think these have any influence on the problems this thread covers. It may be, of course, that different MAPs apply different configurations, so it’s possible that there are variations. We may learn in due course whether this is significant. 

The three systems described in the config file table above are all based on the Aclara SGM 1416-B meter. This is taken from Aclara’s manual for the SGM 1400-B series:
  

So the designations seen in the table (S2AD and S2ADE) don’t match the manufacturer’s description of the meter, unless this is referring to different sorts of elements. It’s clearly immaterial, since Joan’s S2ADE seems to be working as intended.
  

Incidentally, my own SGM 1416-B is designated S2B, which sounds not far off, although I’d expect it to be S2BDE. I’m not losing any sleep over it. 

LOL my head hurts after reading recent contributions…..

It certainly adds confirmation that this issue isnt going to be solved by a quick call to customer services :)

Serves you right for dismissing my suggestion 😊

FAO Firedog.

Happy New Year all….lets hope all our respective issuses solved once and for all.

I might come across as angry and frustrated most of the time (and thats probably true lol) but Im actually getting very twitchy about my complete lack of proper billing from Ovo.

Assuming nothing is sorted by 08.01. I will then have five monthly bills where usage charges are practically nil and all I have been billed for is the standng charges.

Im writing down weekly costs from my IHD but I have no idea if these are guranteed to be accurate, albeit subject to adjustment becuase of the E7/E10 debacle

I really want to rattle someones cage who has the ability to sort things. My formal complaint has so far had all the effect of a wet lettuce…..Anyone have any suggestions?

Im an accountant by trade and its just not in my nature to let financial issues like this drift on and on.

All the best

Thanks: noted and acted upon.

I completely understand your frustration @MikeMilf. If your meter is clocking consumption I don’t see why the support team can’t manually calculate your usage? 

Aye its getting incredily frustating

On the Usage section of the website, it says we cant find your data, but on the Meter Readings section, they are there for all to see!

Even if they suddenly woke up today and attempted to correct matters, there is still the question of incorrect timings and tariffs.

Next week I will remind them they are half way through the formal complaint timetable with absolutely nothing done so far on their part. Trouble is I dont think they give a stuff and the Ombudsman is a pretty regular threat to them

I’ve been following this with interest….

I was on a THTC tariff with SSE and then moved onto an Economy 10 meter (non-smart) and tariff before migrating to OVO.

Everything is working as before with the off-peak times but I am worried that at some point my meter will be phased out and I’ll have to switch to a smart-meter.  I’ve no objections to a smart meter per se - as long as it doesn’t change my off-peak hours.

We can check that first. It would have to be in a general context rather than for your specific circumstances. But if you’re cool with that, we’ve got ways of doing that.

Would you be OK to hang in there for a few days?

Of course - that would be hugely appreciated.  There’s no urgency as all is fine just now - but it would be really great to know what I should be possible.
 

Very many thanks for being so helpful 

No worries. The state of play for Economy 7 is pretty easy - OVO fully supports that with Smart Meters already, as long as you’re already on Economy 7 (support for switching to/from it from all possible scenarios is planned).

Economy 10 however is an edge case that seems to keep changing. We’ll dig into the details and chat with the Forum Moderators about the latest status and let you know.