Why wont my Geo Trio II connect with Aclara S1 meters - gets Error code S-21?

Hey there @MP99 ,

Good one this one actually!

My understanding is that the Geo Trio II is a SMETS2 IHD, so it won’t work with SMETS1 meters. I can check the compatibility if you’d like me to though. Please show me photos of your meters and IHD in your next reply. That’ll allow me to double check for you.

Hi Thanks for the reply. The Smart meters and the Geo remote were supplied by EDF about four years ago and the Geo remote hasn’t worked for the last two years with the same network error problem with absolutely no solution forthcoming. Photos of the meters are attached. Tks.

Sorry about this, but it looks like the photos didn’t attach properly. Could you try again for me?

If you still can’t get them up, don’t worry. You can also send them to forum@ovoenergy.com and either @Tim_OVO or @Jess_OVO will be able to post them on your behalf.

Not sure whether the uploads of the photos of the meters  worked so here is another go.

Hmm… Still not working I’m afraid. Could you email them over?

I have sent the photos to forum@ovoenergy.com

Thanks! I’ll keep an eye on this thread and get back to you once the photos are up. Chances are they’ll be posted here in the morning, sorry for the trouble!

From there, my plan will be to verify exactly what you’ve got and then do some digging. I’ve always been used to the Geo Trio II being S2, but I’ve got ways to look that up if I need to - by digging up user manuals and tearing through the SmartMe document library!

Thanks Blastoise 186.

Thanks for emailing across those photos, @MP99. I’ll post them below so we can see what you’re working with.

Have you taken a look at our Geo IHD guide yet?

• Geo Trio smart in home display (IHD) FAQs F.A.Q.

I wonder if our Geo expert @kevinmcintyre09 might also have some more info on this exact error message.

Ah yes, the classic SMETS1 Aclara SGM1311 Smart Energy Meter and Aclara SGC1311 Smart Communications Hub. This is the worlds easiest meter to identify because its literally the only Smart Meter in the UK with a humongous display - which is actually a brilliant feature because it makes taking meter readings super easy.

I know this meter well as I used to have one myself. In fact, I’ve already got one diagnostic trick you can try here. This might not bear any fruit, but if you’re OK with giving it a go, it might help figure something out.

With the IHD turned on and close to the meter, go through the B button menus on the meter until you get to screens about signal strengths. Once you find one, let it auto-scroll until you reach IHD Signal Strength and please tell me the reading you get from that screen.

If the IHD is currently capable of connecting at all, this will show a reading of a numeric value followed by dBm, such as -30dBm. If it’s not connected at all, you’ll see something else like Not Available instead.

Haha, the SEO of this forum is overpowered! XD

Anyway, I want to credit Geo for the answer, so the original info I’m using came from https://assets.geotogether.com/sites/4/20170719152415/SM2D-A-USG-001_1.pdf . It should be close enough for all versions of the Geo Trio II, whether it’s the Touchscreen, Touchbutton or Accessible version.

The S-21 Error Code indicates your IHD is too far away from the meter can’t can’t get a signal. If you still get S-21 with the IHD right next to the electric meter, you’ll want to talk to your supplier because something else may have gone wrong. That’s the best I’ve got right now.

Hi Jesse,

I am out and about at the moment, but seen the email. So will try and look later.

Cheers,

Kevin @geo

Thanks for the advice. Just got to it. Yesterday was a long day at work.

The IHD is right next to the meter for your suggested test and the meter shows a variable set of values for the IHD signals strength on subsequent elections via the button B: -128dNm, -312, -41 but still no network connection Error S-21. So it is back to the frustrating dialogue with EDF. This has been going on with them for nearly two years. Lots of excuses such as upgrading meters to be compatible with other suppliers, delays due to Covid!

No worries. Kevin actually happens to work at Geo and he’s one of their experts. OVO doesn’t supply Geo IHDs (although SSE did) so I don’t have much experience in dealing with them. It’s something I’m working on learning as inevitably, we’re going to be seeing more queries as more SSE customers are migrated over to OVO.

With that being said, I’m not happy with the readings you’ve given me, which suggests a possible fault somewhere. With the IHD right next to the meter, I’d expect a signal strength of something more like -30dBm and if it’s literally right on top of the meter, perhaps even as strong as -10dBm. However, -128dBm from under 2m away is impossible under normal circumstances.

Pretty much SMETS1 Aclara meters should already be on DCC at this stage as they were among the first to migrate. It’s a mostly automated process from my understanding as well. Someone at your supplier basically presses go and walks away while the computers then take over the rest… Or at least, that’s my understanding.

Thanks Blastoise 186. I will try to get in contact with EDF by phone (some hope!). Their online chat is not helpful at all!

Hi Blastoise186,

All Trio devices are both SMETS1 and SMETS2, and adapt based on which meter environment it was installed with. 

Wow, so you clearly thought about that then! I just wish Chameleon and Hildebrand would do the same as well. It would make life a lot easier. Could you put that into your help centre by any chance? I’m sure a LOT of people would appreciate it!

I suspect others don’t as it costs more to maintain and test your code. For us we have mainly focused on the person in the van who would need to pick up similar looking boxes and make sure they had the right one. Before my time at geo, but I believe this was originally requirements from our lead customers.

When you say ‘Could you put that into your help centre by any chance? I’m sure a LOT of people would appreciate it!’ do you mean geo’s FAQs on our website, or Ovo’s FAQs on geo’s devices?

That’s fair but good to see Geo doing something helpful, even if others don’t (please don’t get me started on the IHDL SmartView 2).

If you’re able to get this info into the Geo help centre, that would be great. The one for OVO might be possible too, but I’ll have to summon an ancient philosopher about that. Good thing I know Timsonius, 4th Century BC eh @Tim_OVO ?

Hi Kevin. The meter appears to be in dumb mode although EDF appear to be getting readings from it because my bills never show estimated values and I never get requests to read the meter. The IHD looks to be an older version than the one you show in the photo. I have taken a  shot which shows it right next to the meter.

Actually, that does appear to be the Geo Trio II Touchbutton by the looks of things. Pretty similar to the Touchscreen models other than how you interact with the device. The one in Kevin’s photo seems to be the original model.

I note that your meter doesn’t see anything on the HAN either. That’s a possible clue…

The good news is that there’s a strong WAN Signal. So it’s not totally dead.

Hi @Blastoise186  yes I am sure we can get this added to our FAQs, I will ask the support team to add this

MP99 wrote:

Hi Kevin. The meter appears to be in dumb mode although EDF appear to be getting readings from it because my bills never show estimated values and I never get requests to read the meter. The IHD looks to be an older version than the one you show in the photo. I have taken a  shot which shows it right next to the meter.

 

 

Hi @MP99, as @Blastoise186 points out this is actually the Trio Touchbutton.

Silly question I am assuming you are an Ovo customer, hence was asking if you switched to Ovo and it had gone into dumb mode due to the switch. Howevever, it sounds like you are an EDF customer if they are getting your meter reads, and using that for your billing. 

It would be helpful to know what the system status screen is showing, this gives us a lot of information on what the metering network is doing. You can find this pressing the Home button to show the main menu (when you are on the Home screen), then scrolling to System status (pressing the ‘o’ button to select it).

Once you select this you will see this screen, I am expecting at least one of your items to show a red version of the icon. If you scroll to that icon and select it, you should get a pop-up screen showing the system status (2nd image below example). If you could let me have the codes or take pictures for any that are red. The firmware on your Trio might be quiet old, so don’t worry if you status number does not have a dash and number after it. In the newer versions we added more codes to help us and utilities remotely debug the issues.